Re: Skype issues that I see, response to several messages on this list today


Mike DeZinno
 

Hi Doug,
Re "meet now service":
Not needing to have software on your machine to be able to join in is also a very popular trend and is probably one of the main driving forces for Zoom's growing popularity.

These services offering 24/7 open communications I guess are the  modern evolution of the old 24/7 telephone conference lines that people used years ago to build MLM businesses.

I just wish that these international mega billions companies could find it in their hearts to dedicate a small fraction of their gross revenue to orphan tech like accessibility for the blind.  Even if they didn't want to do the actual work then at least they could underwrite people like yourself who are willing to take on the task.

Just my thoughts of appreciation for how far we have come in my 70 plus years but still aware of how far we still have to go.

All stay well,
Mike in SC


At 12:48 PM 4/8/2020 Wednesday, you wrote:
You are kind. :-)

Realistically though, the world started going from mostly Skype to a diverse set of alternatives years ago. The virus only served to make more urgent the need for us to keep up with all of those alternatives. Also, NVDA has
become popular enough that scripting for JAWS is no longer enough to fill the needs of everyone. The significant increase in choices does indeed complicate my life, but so it goes in general. In short, the telecommunication
landscape and the screen reader landscape are both going the way of the Roman empire; so no one, no solution, and no script will anymore enjoy Caesar status. :-)

As it happens, I have resumed work on Skype UWP scripts even though I expect Skype UWP to change completely in very short order. The reason is the arrival of this Meet Now service by Microsoft, whereby one can build a
permanent call/meeting that is open to all, even to those with no Skype and with Skype but no Skype account. Clicking a shared Meet Now link seems to open Skype UWP on most Windows 10 machines. I saw information about this a
day or two ago and resumed Skype UWP work last night. I don't have an ETA for a script update yet though.

On Wed, Apr 08, 2020 at 12:10:53PM -0400, Mike DeZinno wrote:
   Good day All,
   Just to way-in on this topic; I am also finding the need to explore
   other software like Team Talk, Zoom, and others
   I feel badly for Doug Lee, who has now for several years tried against
   all odds to make Skype work for us like it once did, only to keep
   having to fix something that keeps getting more difficult to keep up
   with because of Skype's constant changes and quirks. .
   Just like we all had to let go of Skype 7.xx versions I guess we should
   maybe get ready to some day do the same with Skype in general and be
   open to finding software that is more naturally accessible to the blind
   community.
   I say these things not out of anger but rather out of an honest feeling
   of guilt that we keep needing so much of Doug's time spent just trying
   to not get too far behind with all the work he needs to do and re-do
   just to keep Skype almost working day to day.
   Many heart felt thanks to you Doug for all you do for us.
   Stay well all,
   Mike in SC
   At 10:57 AM 4/8/2020 Wednesday, you wrote:

     Hi Doug,
     Thank you for the list of Skype alternatives. I tested some of them,
     and I will test TeamTalk, TeamSpeak and Zello, because the ones I
     tried are not at least as good as the old Skype for Desktop.
     --Octavian
     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Lee" <dgl@...>
     To: <main@skypeenglish.groups.io>
     Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2020 3:38 PM
     Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Skype issues that I see, response to
     several messages on this list today

     I can confirm that Skype can be slow to switch chats. I'm pretty
     sure that happens regardless of whether you run scripts, or even
     JAWS; but someone please prove me wrong if possible.
     The hotkey for moving to message history is also not working as well
     as it once did, but I may be able to fix that one. I noticed it
     earlier this weekend but did not include it in my message because I
     wanted to test it
     further before commenting on it.
     As for Skype alternatives, here's a somewhat complete list of what
     I've worked with lately, in no particular order. This list includes
     of course only the clients and platforms I've seen and/or scripted
     in a non-professional
     setting; i.e., I've scripted other clients under contract and am not
     listing those here.
     I have scripts for Unigram, the Windows 10 Telegram client that is
     most accessible. The app comes from the Windows Store; the scripts
     come from [1]https://www.dlee.org/unigram/
     In fact, my use of Unigram includes hosting my project update
     announcement channel there, along with a paired discussion group for
     the things I release. See my contact page for current details:
     [2]https://www.dlee.org/contact/
     A while ago, I did a bit of Discord scripting for a couple of folks;
     but those are surely pretty out of date by now. I'm told that
     Discord text chatting is still pretty accessible though.
     I have fairly comprehensive scripts for Slack at
     [3]https://www.dlee.org/slack/ and some very soon to be
     significantly updated scripts for Microsoft Teams, which will
     replace Skype For Business (SFB), at
     [4]https://www.dlee.org/teams/
     Both of those are more for the professional arena I think, but I
     think they can be used outside of that environment.
     I am not listing my SFB scripts here, though I have three different
     sets of those for different SFB versions, because as I said, Teams
     will be replacing SFB. Also, SFB is exclusively for professional
     settings as far as I know.
     Of course there's also Zoom, which is probably the most popular of
     the platforms now for voice. It also supports text chatting, and
     scripts for that one are included in JAWS 2020 and also are
     available from Bryan Hartgen.
     Then we have TeamTalk and TeamSpeak, which I scripted as well:
     [5]https://www.dlee.org/teamtalk/ and
     [6]https://www.dlee.org/teamspeak/
     Those are also more known for voice but do support texting.
     TeamSpeak will at some point move to a new structure that has global
     text chat support much like Discord, but the date for that has
     remained uncertain for quite some
     months by now.
     And I guess I will complete my list with that old but amazingly
     still kickin' client known as Zello. I still have scripts for that
     one at [7]https://www.dlee.org/zello/ though I rarely work on that
     one because I long ago got
     tired of wrestling with bugs in the Windows client. Still, the
     platform survives and gets used, especially in emergency settings
     from all I hear, though again, more for voice than for text I think.
     On Sun, Apr 05, 2020 at 03:09:30PM +0300, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
     Even worse then those things is that the hotkey Control+Insert+Y to
     move to
     the list of chat messages is not working anymore, sometimes after
     opening
     Skype nothing happends when pressing Shift+Tab or Tab for moving
     there, and
     this for several minutes, also sometimes Skype appears as locked for
     several
     minutes when pressing Alt+1, so if somebody sends me a message, I am
     not
     able to read that message immediately until Skype starts working
     well.
     This happends when using latest Skype with your scripts under
     Windows 7.
     Under Windows 10 there are many more other bad things that appear in
     many
     other applications, so passing to Windows 10 is not a solution.
     You tested more text and voice chatting apps. Do you know if there
     is one
     that's better accessible for the blind and easier to use than Skype?
     --Octavian
     ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Lee" <dgl@...>
     To: <main@skypeenglish.groups.io>
     Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2020 12:09 AM
     Subject: [skypeenglish] Skype issues that I see, response to several
     messages on this list today

     Let me address some claims I've seen, today on this list and
     elsewhere
     over time, about Skype for Windows, and some of my own claims
     besides:
     Claim 1: Skype online status is sometimes wrong.
     True. In the past few weeks, I've seen a Skype status of "Last seen
     days
     ago" for contacts I saw less than six days earlier. To my initial
     alarm,
     that message has for some time been widely recognized as meaning
     that you
     are
     blocked by the contact. I find this no longer to be the case; I've
     seen
     friends and professional colleagues alike display as "Last seen days
     ago"
     without having blocked me.
     Claim 2: Skype mood text can be wrong.
     True. For quite a while and through several Skype 8 versions, I've
     seen
     the mood text for one contact stay active while I switched through
     chats
     with several other contacts, until I happen to open a chat with
     another
     contact
     who actually has a mood text. In short, the mood text does not clear
     until
     it is changed to a new message. I have repeatedly reported this bug
     to
     Microsoft but have not seen any sign of it being addressed.
     Claim 3: "File sent" no longer speaks after a file transfer.
     Not sure about this one. I do know that "File sent" finally stopped
     speaking after the sending of a chat message, but I don't send files
     much.
     I also know that both of those messages are not likely to speak if
     you
     split your
     chat windows out from the main Skype window, because of the way the
     Skype
     notifications work.
     Claim 4: Skype UWP for Windows 10 is going away.
     Mixed. Reliable indications exist that Skype UWP will become like,
     or
     become equal to, Skype for Windows Desktop in some way. I don't know
     if
     the Store app is going away entirely; but since it comes with
     Windows 10
     now, I
     doubt it. Those on the Windows Insider program, which I am not, can
     probably say more about this one.
     Claim 5: Focus sticks to the "1 star" button after a Skype-to-phone
     call.
     Uncertain but reliably reported. If anyone else has seen this one,
     please
     let me know. I have not seen this one on my machine, and I make a
     fair
     number of Skype-to-phone calls; but I may have just jumped past it
     too
     fast.
     I hope this message helps clear up a few uncertainties for people.
     --
     Doug Lee               Â
     dgl@...                [8]http://www.dlee.org
     Level Access             doug.lee@...
     [9]http://www.LevelAccess.com
     "Believe, when you are most unhappy, that there is something for you
     to do in the world. So long as you can sweeten another's pain, life
     is
     not in vain." --Helen Keller

     --
     Doug Lee               Â
     dgl@...                [10]http://www.dlee.org
     Level Access             doug.lee@...
     [11]http://www.LevelAccess.com
     "The most exhausting thing in life is being insincere."
            - Anne Morrow Lindbergh {American Author}

  

References

   1. https://www.dlee.org/unigram/
   2. https://www.dlee.org/contact/
   3. https://www.dlee.org/slack/
   4. https://www.dlee.org/teams/
   5. https://www.dlee.org/teamtalk/
   6. https://www.dlee.org/teamspeak/
   7. https://www.dlee.org/zello/
   8. http://www.dlee.org/
   9. http://www.levelaccess.com/
  10. http://www.dlee.org/
  11. http://www.levelaccess.com/
  12. https://skypeenglish.groups.io/g/main/message/4430
  13. mailto:main@skypeenglish.groups.io?subject=Re: Re: [skypeenglish] Skype issues that I see, response to several messages on this list today
  14. mailto:mike@...?subject=Private: Re: Re: [skypeenglish] Skype issues that I see, response to several messages on this list today
  15. https://groups.io/mt/72778942/409874
  16. https://skypeenglish.groups.io/g/main/post
  17. http://www.dlee.org/skype/
  18. https://skypeenglish.groups.io/g/main/editsub/409874
  19. mailto:main+owner@skypeenglish.groups.io
  20. https://skypeenglish.groups.io/g/main/leave/defanged

--
Doug Lee                 dgl@...                http://www.dlee.org
Level Access             doug.lee@...    http://www.LevelAccess.com
What is most worth paying for, you buy with the life you live.
(11/10/07)

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