locked Re: Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com

Octavian Rasnita
 

Hi Andre,

Very well said. You pointed even more bad things in Skype 8 than me.

Regarding Slack, many people past to Slack because it offers more features, it offers the possibility of integration with many other web sites, it offers an API, so messages can be sent automaticly by applications, while Microsoft disabled even that poor Skype API that was offered in past.

But if you think that MS wants to copy Slack is even worse, because Slack is accessible, but bnot very friendly for the blind. They made some improvements in accessibility after I reported them, but not very fast, and not complete, and not all accessibility complaints were solved yet.

It is bad if MS wants to copy just the interface which is not very friendly for us, but doesn't start by first copying the backend features that makes Slack good.

--Octavian

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andre Polykanine" <@Menelion>
To: "Shaun Oliver" <skypeenglish@groups.io>
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2018 1:49 AM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com


Hello Shaun,
Well, well. You're really a bit too harsh, but OK, let's be harsh
then.
Skype 8 sucks indeed. Not as a piece of software, but as a
*messenger*. See the difference: a messenger should be fast, light on
CPU and memory usage, and not only accessible, but usable. I'm a huge
fan of Web technologies myself, but here they are in the wrong place.
So let's list what's missing in Skype 8 comparing to Skype 7:
1. Separate chat windows. Yes, this is important when you have a
separate chat with your boss, another one with a project manager,
another one with a group of developers, and a couple personal ones. If
your company uses Skype for work, it is a daily scenario. Can you
manage to cope with it in Skype electron? Yes, you can, but not that
fast. Far not. Commpare pressing Alt+Tab with those cumbersome
gestures in a single window.
2. Performance. My PC is quite old, it has a Core I5 CPU and 4 gigs of
RAM. Skype 7 works like a charm, though with Skype 8 I often have my
fans rotating at high speeds, and the app crashes quite often during
calls. "buy a new machine," could you say. For a messenger? I mean,
really?
3. Sounds are not customizable. I still use classic sounds in Skype 7,
and I'll give you a reason for that: when I'm away from my PC and I
hear that loud old-fashioned phone ringing from my headphones, I know someone wants my
attention in Skype. Was it too hard to implement in a newer version?
I'm 100% sure it was not.
4. Alt+numbers in chats. If you ever talked in a rather crowded group chat
with sighted people, you understand my point:
Tab-Shift-Tab-arrow-up-arrow-down just don't work, you miss messages.
5. Skype 7 has a plethora of settings, like: show or hide animated
emoticons, link previews, user avatars, how to quote messages, what to do on
pressing Enter, and so on, and so forth. Skype 8 left us with a tiny
piece of that settings tree which prevents it from being a
professional messenger.
6. Global hotkeys: someone calls me while I'm working in an IDE, a
word processor, an e-mail client or a sound editor. Do I have to go and
desperately search for a Skype window to pick up the call? Are you
serious?
7. the main interface itself. Again, I don't say it is inaccessible,
but it is far from being *comfortable* to use. Skype was the only and
the last messenger with native-like windows, and now Skype 8 came.
Everyone uses Slack these days. Well, Microsoft said, let's do it like
Slack, maybe they will come back to Skype? It is the same error when
everyone imitates Apple's phone design by removing home buttons and
headphone jacks in a desperate hope that "if we
are like Apple, we will have billions of users". When Skype was
special and particular, everyone used it just because it was
comfortable both for large businesses and for aged people. It was
peer-to-peer, it allowed sending large files, its interface was simple
and its sound quality was decent. Nowadays however amount of Skype
users decreases, and sighted users also complain about Skype 8
interface that is sluggish and drains batteries on laptops and cell
phones.
If they fixed those issues I described, at least partially, it would be
great. I don't blame them for doing it bad, I blame them for choosing
a wrong technology. Electron is not suitable for a messenger, it's a
virtual machine upon another virtual machine, so to say. I wouldn't
blame them even if they provided an API, but they don't,
unfortunately.

--
With best regards from Ukraine,
Andre
Skype: menelion_elensule
Twitter (English only): @AndrePolykanine


------------ Original message ------------
From: Shaun Oliver <blindman75@...>
To: skypeenglish@groups.io
Date created: , 1:06:43 AM
Subject: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com


I'm going to comment here, and I'm likely going to not only appear contrary, but, quite harsh, and I make no appology for it. you have been warned.




Firstly, Sarah is right. Skype 8, even though it is still called Skype preview, is very easy to navigate. if you have experience navigating a web style interface, you can navigate skype without issue. If you've yet to at least gain competency in navigating a web interface or similar, then you have nobody to blame but yourself for the issues you're facing navigating Skype 8. I am talking collectively here I am not pointing the finger at any one individual.




Furthermore, the interface is no different under windows7 as it is, under windows 10. As for windows 10 being unstable, Pardon my use of the colorful vernacular, but, bullshit!




Unless you know what you speak of, hold your tongue and if you must offer an oppinion, make it an informed oppinion not filled with supposition and hearsay. Windows10 is quite stable. and as is with any other platform, yes, things break. sometimes majorly when there's an update, but, the same is true of both IOS and android and I might add, MacOSX.




Software developers now not only listen to feedback about accessibility these days, but, they listen to feedback about what's broken and fix it in fairly short order. So have a care how you speak, because unless your oppinions are based on actual provable evidence, you are talking out of the wrong orifice and need to give the other one a go.





On 10/08/2018 02:47, Sarah k Alawami wrote:


Actualy skype 8 for windows is equally as good I learned it in about maybe 5 minutes of just tinkering around. I use it every day on my youtube streams. If you don’t believe me go to my youtube page.I can get around it farily quickly with nvda.

On 7 Aug 2018, at 13:27, Octavian Rasnita wrote:




"just takes geting used to".

Yes, but this, and the fact that it doesn't have some features that Skype 7 has, makes it worse than Skype 7. :)
Getting used to something means effort and time consumed, and Skype 7 doesn't require this.
It is good to consume time to learn something new that helps, but for the moment I've seen only missing features in Skype 8, not new helpful things that we can do with it.
It would be great for example if it will have an API that can be used for sending chat messages from programs.

I see you compare Skype 8 with the version for Mac, but most Skype users use it under Windows and they will probably never intend to use Mac, so for them is not helpful at all if Skype 8 is similar with the one for Mac, or if the Mac style of using the computer is more friendly with Skype 8, or anything Mac related.

The truth is that Skype 8 is much worse accessible than Skype 7 when it is used under Windows with JAWS, and I guess that this is the most used combination.

I don't know how easy is to use it with Windows 10 yet, but from what I read from other blind Windows 10 users, Windows 10 is not stable yet, and some updates can damage some things until the next update, so this is also not very useful.

--Octavian


----- Original Message -----
From: Sarah k Alawami
To: skypeenglish@groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2018 8:39 PM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com




Not true. I use it every day for my streams and my jobs. It is 100 percent accessible and usable and just takes geting used to, so give it a chance.

On 6 Aug 2018, at 20:34, Josephine Hirsch wrote:




new version of Skype really sucks, and is hard to use with screenreaders regardless if you have any type of impairment



On 8/6/2018 10:09 PM, Kimmie wrote:





Yeah I definitely put my feedback in there and told them to get their act together.





From: skypeenglish@groups.io [mailto:skypeenglish@groups.io] On Behalf Of Jerry Pryde
Sent: Tuesday, 7 August 2018 8:33 a.m.
To: skypeenglish@groups.io
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com






This is really good news.


It sounds like they’ve gotten some seriously negative feedback on the new version.


I’ve even heard from people with sight that don’t like it.


Long Live Skype Classic.














From: John Holcomb II


Sent: Monday, August 06, 2018 2:00 PM


To: skypeenglish@groups.io


Subject: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com





https://www.thurrott.com/cloud/microsoft-consumer-services/skype/165295/microsoft-backtracks-classic-skype-lives-see-another-day





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