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what's hard to use about windows10? how is the command structure
different at its core than that of windows7?
really people, you're going to be forced in to using win10 in two
or three years anyway, so you might as well bite the damned bullet
and get with the program. again, I'm not appologizing for being
harsh, but seriously people, pissing and moaning about how much
worse things are, is doing nothing more than showing your
inability to adapt. and that, my friends, does you a great
in a couple of years when you're forced to update to win10, are
you goign to give up computing altogether? no, you're not. so
instead of being dragged kicking and screaming, whaling, nashing
your teeth, crying and wetting your diapers out of protest, take
some initiative, and make the transition now, so that when you
have no choice down the track, you can at least say you're ahead
of the game and you are competent with using windows10. I've said
very little on this list and mostly just read the goings on, but,
for the last three weeks, I have seen nothing but bitching,
moaning, crying, diaper wetting, about how the world's ending
because skype is inaccessible. inaccessible to me means firstly
the screenreader won't render it at all. nor, can it be used, even
if you implement OCR as provided with NVDA and I believe JAWS has
it also, if I cannot at least use the mouse to get around
something and work it, it is all but inaccessible to me.
and I'm attempting to play world of warcraft. so go figure. that
is all but inaccessible but it is doable.
again, people, stop the belly aching and make a concerted effort
to better yourselves and your computing skills and keep them up to
date, or you will become obsolete. that, is not good for you or
your potential employability.
think on that, please?
On 10/08/2018 03:55, Josephine Hirsch
The thing about Skype 8 is that I do not like it because it
took me 2 hours to use it. I like Skype 7 because I have Windows
7 OS and no offense, Windows 10 is hard to use, plus, the
commands for Windows 10 is way different than Windows 7. I am
glad that someone have put their foot down by telling MS that
they can't DC Skype 7 because people are used to it.
On 8/9/2018 12:53 PM, Octavian
"Actualy skype 8 for windows is equally as good I learned
it in about maybe 5 minutes of just tinkering around.".
Oh yeah, but this is because you are great! Not all the
people are the same and not all of them use the computer for
the same things. :-)
I used Windows 7 for years, but I still hate it and
consider it less accessible than Windows XP.
Even now after so many years, it is still very bad accessible
with some applications like TextPad, or MS DOS command prompt
when comparing it with the same apps and screen reader under
You said that you use NVDA. This means that probably you
like it. I don't. Actually I don't like the object navigation.
I was sighted and I want to have an experience as close as
possible with the one offered to the sighted that can have a
visual perspective of the entire screen without analysing each
object and sub-object one by one. Maybe with the style of NVDA
Skype 8 is OK.
Window Eyes was a great screen reader many years ago,
however for the single reason that it enforced the users to
use the horrible numpad, I refused to use it. This was enough.
Because I don't like to use numpad at all for other things
just typing digits. For other people this might not be
important at all.
However, Windows 7 has some stability improvements, so
there aren't just disadvantages.
But in Skype 8 I haven't heard about any advantage yet.
This is why I said that Skype 8 is worse for me. It may be
as good as Skype 7 for you or others, or maybe even better,
but this doesn't make it better for me.
Our different opinions don't mean contradiction, but are
based on our different needs and preferences.
For me "learning" means a different thing than for you for
For me, learning means muscle learning, so I don't even need
to think how to use it.
If you ask me how I start chatting with somebody on Skype,
I'll need to stay a little and think all the steps one by one,
and I may not be able to tell you all the steps without doing
it. But when I really want to start chatting with somebody, I
know that I need to press Insert+F11 to open the list of apps
in System tray, and from that point on is just muscle memory,
and I don't remember all the steps, but I do it very fast,
without needing to hear too much from the screen reader. It is
like the muscle memory needed to type a text very fast,
without thinking to every letter that you need to type.
And well, unfortunately I'm not so good and I can't change my
way of working and re-learning all the hotkey combinations to
do what I want as fast as before just in 5 minutes.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2018 8:17 PM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks,
Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com
Actualy skype 8 for windows is equally as good I
learned it in about maybe 5 minutes of just tinkering
around. I use it every day on my youtube streams. If you
don’t believe me go to my
youtube page. I can get around it farily quickly
On 7 Aug 2018, at 13:27, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
"just takes geting used to".
Yes, but this, and the fact that it doesn't have
some features that Skype 7 has, makes it worse than
Skype 7. :)
Getting used to something means effort and time
consumed, and Skype 7 doesn't require this.
It is good to consume time to learn something new
that helps, but for the moment I've seen only
missing features in Skype 8, not new helpful things
that we can do with it.
It would be great for example if it will have an
API that can be used for sending chat messages from
I see you compare Skype 8 with the version for
Mac, but most Skype users use it under Windows and
they will probably never intend to use Mac, so for
them is not helpful at all if Skype 8 is similar
with the one for Mac, or if the Mac style of using
the computer is more friendly with Skype 8, or
anything Mac related.
The truth is that Skype 8 is much worse
accessible than Skype 7 when it is used under
Windows with JAWS, and I guess that this is the most
I don't know how easy is to use it with Windows
10 yet, but from what I read from other blind
Windows 10 users, Windows 10 is not stable yet, and
some updates can damage some things until the next
update, so this is also not very useful.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2018 8:39 PM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft
Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day
Not true. I use it every day for my streams
and my jobs. It is 100 percent accessible and
usable and just takes geting used to, so give
it a chance.
On 6 Aug 2018, at 20:34, Josephine Hirsch
new version of Skype really sucks, and is
hard to use with screenreaders regardless
if you have any type of impairment
On 8/6/2018 10:09 PM, Kimmie wrote:
Yeah I definitely put my
feedback in there and told them to
get their act together.
really good news.
like they’ve gotten some
seriously negative feedback on
the new version.
heard from people with sight
that don’t like it.
August 06, 2018 2:00 PM
Skype Lives to See
Another Day -