I think the easiness of usage of different versions
of a program can be partially measured by the number of keystrokes and hotkeys
needed to do a certain thing.
If the number of keypresses/hotkeys is for example
double, it means that the new version is twice as hard to use and consumes more
time and brain.
I don't know what's the situation of Skype 8 from
this point of view.
If it requires fewer hotkeys *with JAWS*, not NVDA,
then yes, I think I might got used to it and consider it better after a time of
using it.
The ideal application is the one that doesn't need
to be used at all. :)
--Octavian
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2018 10:12
PM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft
Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com
Wow, 2 hours? I downloaded skype 8 and learned on a youtube stream how to
use it in a matter of minutes.. It is jut like a web page and if you use your
quick nav keys un nvda or jaws ou will be able to get around the interface
lightning fast. They work well.
On 9 Aug 2018, at 11:25, Josephine Hirsch wrote:
The thing about Skype 8 is that I do not like it because it took me 2
hours to use it. I like Skype 7 because I have Windows 7 OS and no offense,
Windows 10 is hard to use, plus, the commands for Windows 10 is way
different than Windows 7. I am glad that someone have put their foot down by
telling MS that they can't DC Skype 7 because people are used to
it.
On 8/9/2018 12:53 PM, Octavian Rasnita
wrote:
"Actualy skype 8 for windows is equally as good I learned it in about
maybe 5 minutes of just tinkering around.".
Oh yeah, but this is because you are great! Not all the people are
the same and not all of them use the computer for the same things.
:-)
I used Windows 7 for years, but I still hate it and consider it less
accessible than Windows XP.
Even now after so many years, it is still
very bad accessible with some applications like TextPad, or MS DOS command
prompt when comparing it with the same apps and screen reader under
Windows XP.
You said that you use NVDA. This means that probably you like it. I
don't. Actually I don't like the object navigation. I was sighted and I
want to have an experience as close as possible with the one offered to
the sighted that can have a visual perspective of the entire screen
without analysing each object and sub-object one by one. Maybe with the
style of NVDA Skype 8 is OK.
Window Eyes was a great screen reader many years ago, however for the
single reason that it enforced the users to use the horrible numpad, I
refused to use it. This was enough. Because I don't like to use numpad at
all for other things just typing digits. For other people this might not
be important at all.
However, Windows 7 has some stability improvements, so there aren't
just disadvantages.
But in Skype 8 I haven't heard about any advantage
yet.
This is why I said that Skype 8 is worse for me. It may be as good as
Skype 7 for you or others, or maybe even better, but this doesn't make it
better for me.
Our different opinions don't mean contradiction, but are based on our
different needs and preferences.
For me "learning" means a different thing than for you for
sure.
For me, learning means muscle learning, so I don't even need to
think how to use it.
If you ask me how I start chatting with somebody
on Skype, I'll need to stay a little and think all the steps one by one,
and I may not be able to tell you all the steps without doing it. But when
I really want to start chatting with somebody, I know that I need to press
Insert+F11 to open the list of apps in System tray, and from that point on
is just muscle memory, and I don't remember all the steps, but I do it
very fast, without needing to hear too much from the screen reader. It is
like the muscle memory needed to type a text very fast, without thinking
to every letter that you need to type.
And well, unfortunately I'm not
so good and I can't change my way of working and re-learning all the
hotkey combinations to do what I want as fast as before just in 5
minutes.
--Octavian
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2018 8:17 PM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic
Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com
Actualy skype 8 for windows is equally as good I learned it in about
maybe 5 minutes of just tinkering around. I use it every day on my
youtube streams. If you don’t believe me go to my youtube page. I can get around it farily
quickly with nvda.
On 7 Aug 2018, at 13:27, Octavian Rasnita wrote:
"just takes geting used to".
Yes, but this, and the fact that it doesn't have some features
that Skype 7 has, makes it worse than Skype 7. :)
Getting used to something means effort and time consumed, and
Skype 7 doesn't require this.
It is good to consume time to learn something new that helps, but
for the moment I've seen only missing features in Skype 8, not new
helpful things that we can do with it.
It would be great for example if it will have an API that can be
used for sending chat messages from programs.
I see you compare Skype 8 with the version for Mac, but most
Skype users use it under Windows and they will probably never intend
to use Mac, so for them is not helpful at all if Skype 8 is similar
with the one for Mac, or if the Mac style of using the computer is
more friendly with Skype 8, or anything Mac related.
The truth is that Skype 8 is much worse accessible than Skype 7
when it is used under Windows with JAWS, and I guess that this is the
most used combination.
I don't know how easy is to use it with Windows 10 yet, but from
what I read from other blind Windows 10 users, Windows 10 is not
stable yet, and some updates can damage some things until the next
update, so this is also not very useful.
--Octavian
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2018 8:39 PM
Subject: Re: [skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks,
Classic Skype Lives to See Another Day - Thurrott.com
Not true. I use it every day for my streams and my jobs. It is
100 percent accessible and usable and just takes geting used to, so
give it a chance.
On 6 Aug 2018, at 20:34, Josephine Hirsch wrote:
new version of Skype really sucks, and is hard to use with
screenreaders regardless if you have any type of
impairment
On 8/6/2018 10:09 PM, Kimmie wrote:
Yeah I definitely put my feedback in there and told
them to get their act together.
This is really good news.
It sounds like they’ve gotten some seriously
negative feedback on the new version.
I’ve even heard from people with sight that
don’t like it.
Sent: Monday,
August 06, 2018 2:00 PM
Subject:
[skypeenglish] Microsoft Backtracks, Classic Skype Lives to See
Another Day - Thurrott.com
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